RE: [Philmont]: Peanuts, EpiPens, and Anaphylaxis

Absolutely Right Shane. Thanks for pointing that out. This was actually
part of my point, but I didn't state it clearly. That's why I said you
need to work closely with the family. They need to get these meds for
the patient which will have the proper dosage for THAT patient. In my
haste I wasn't clear. I was trying to indicate that as an Advisor, you
can't just go to a drug store and pick up some inhalers and a few
epi-pens. It doesn't work that way.
 Another point that popped into my head, these meds, especially Epi,
have a life, make sure the drugs your crew brings are within their
useful life. I had a patient a few weeks ago with an anaphylatic
reaction. We were informed on the way to the scene that he had an
epi-pen and had administered it. We breathed easy but got there fast.
His pen had no effect, I checked the date and it was expired by 2 years!
Also, epi is susceptible to UV light, so it should be kept in dark
opaque containers and out of the sun (maglite cases work great for
this). If the liquid in the pen is cloudy, replace it, it is probably
useless. Inhalers can be tricky to know how much is left in them. Here's
a useful trick. Take a new (full) inhaler, remove the mouth tube, and
place it in a glass of water. Mark the level it floats at on the side of
the bottle (can). Then do the same with the partially used bottle and
note the difference. This will give you a good idea of what you have in
there.
 Shane made me think of something else too, Pharmacists can provide
valuable information on medications and the effects they will have. If
you have a youth or adult on your crew taking meds you know nothing
about, you might want to ask your local Pharmacist what those drugs are,
how they work, and what side effects they may have paying particular
attention to their effects under heavy exertion. Every time I get a new
Scout that has a condition I am not familiar with, I spend a Sunday
morning reading up on it via various internet resources. I recently had
a parent tell me that her son was "allergic to cold". I suppressed the
urge to laugh and waited until I could check it out. Turns out the
condition she described, and the symptoms she had witnessed matched with
a condition I found. Additional conversations confirmed that I had
indeed found the condition she was referring to, and now I know more,
and her son will get proper treatment should the condition occur.
 I know this is a lot of talk about stuff that will never be an issue
for 98% of the crews going into the high country, but it bears
discussion every year. The purpose for this list and to share knowledge
and experience. You can sum all this up in one simple phrase: "Be
Prepared" (and do your homework!)
 Happy Trekking,
 Tom

> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-philmont@troop47.com
> [mailto:owner-philmont@troop47.com] On Behalf Of Shane Hoffman
> Sent: Saturday, December 03, 2005 8:28 PM
> To: Multiple recipients of list philmont
> Subject: Re: [Philmont]: Peanuts, EpiPens, and Anaphylaxis
>
>
> Replying to one of Tom's comments...
>
> Yes, EpiPens and inhalers are prescription items, BUT you CAN
> ask your
> doctor to write a prescription with a sufficient amount of medication
> dispensed to cover the requirement of having multiple "extra"
> units on hand.
> Doctors will honor this request. Your insurance might not
> pay for the
> extras, but you can pay for them yourself. This is what I
> do. Do not go
> into any long term backcountry situation without enough meds on hand.
>
> Shane Hoffman, R.Ph.
> Advisor Crew 445 - www.crew445.org - SHoffman@crew445.org
> ASM Troop 445 - www.troop445.org - SHoffman@troop445.org
> "We should all realize that every right implies a
> responsibility, every
> opportunity an obligation, every position a duty, and that the most
> effective sermon is expressed in deeds instead of words." ~
> Waite Phillips
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Tom Lindtveit" <n2sa@bestweb.net>
> To: "Multiple recipients of list philmont" <philmont@troop47.com>
> Sent: Saturday, December 03, 2005 8:47 AM
> Subject: RE: [Philmont]: Peanuts, EpiPens, and Anaphylaxis
>
>
> > I've been wanting to reply to this all week, but couldn't get 15
> > minutes of spare time. This is a very important subject for
> advisors
> > including the subject of inhalers. I'll just throw in some
> additional
> > points/thoughts:
> > 1)Epipens and inhalers are prescription drugs. You cannot
> just "bring
> > a few extras". Every state has different laws on these meds. Be
> > familiar with your local laws and protocols.
> > 2) No one who lacks training should be administering medications
> > unless the other option is the death of the patient. You
> NEED to know
> > what you are giving, why, and what the effects will be on that
> > particular patient, as well as the side effects to be expected.
> > 3) Fortunately, this training is not that complicated when you are
> > working with specific drugs. In my state of New York, you can be
> > certified to administer epi and albuterol with some simple classes.
> > You still cannot buy these meds, BUT in the case of Epi,
> your council
> > can buy and stock the pens at camp by filling out and
> filing a single
> > page form with the State Dept. of health. As Scout leaders,
> your best
> > bet is to work with the family closely to make sure
> prescriptions are
> > current and you have adequate quantities. From both a legal AND
> > medical standpoint, it is ALWAYS best to administer a drug that has
> > been prescribed for that particular patient. Use THEIR
> stuff and your
> > liability decreases while their safety increases.
> > 4) If you can't take a good training course like Wilderness
> first aid,
> > then get a good book and STUDY (don't just read) it. A great one is
> > "Wilderness First Aid" put out by the National Safety
> Council and the
> > Wilderness Medical Society. It's also a fantastic Scoutmaster's
> > training reference. I got my copy on eBay for $3.95, but new it is
> > around $20.00.
> > 5) Any decent Wilderness First aid course should have epi trainers
> > available. You need to get familiar with this stuff, how it
> works and
> > how to administer it effectively. Being familiar will make you more
> > relaxed and able to focus on the proper treatment. You need to
> > understand what the symptoms are, and at what point the
> meds should be
> > administered. This is very important. I have an Epi-Scout
> in my unit,
> > and I do the "wait and see" treatment because I know what I
> am looking
> > for and I have detailed information about his allergic
> history. If you
> > are in the backcountry and administer a med when it is not
> needed you
> > may have just fired the only shot you had before it was needed and
> > missed the target as well. Knowledge is power. If you can't find a
> > course, make friends with someone at your local rescue
> squad. Informal
> > training is better than no training at all, and the squad
> should have
> > training materials available. Tell them what your trek will
> be like and
> > how much access you will have to medical help, they should
> be able to
> > prepare you somewhat if they understand your concerns and needs.
> >
> > I encourage every Council to sponsor Wilderness First Aid courses.
> > This training is invaluable to Scout leaders. Even if you
> are an EMT,
> > Paramedic, CFR, Nurse, or Physician, you should take the course.
> > Wilderness protocols are VERY different and more comprehensive than
> > the 'street medicine' protocols (stabilize and transport).
> There were
> > 2 EMT's in my last Wilderness course who kept saying things
> like "but
> > I can't do that in my scope of practice!" and "they never taught us
> > that in my EMT class". 5, 10, or 20 miles from the road, the rules
> > change. If you are going to God's Country next summer, you
> have time
> > to get the training now, and have a safe and memorable adventure.
> >
> > By way of background, I am an active Certified First Responder and
> > have the epi and albuterol certifications. I live in a
> rural area and
> > spend a considerable amount of time 'away from the road'
> and up on the
> > hiking trails. I can tell you that my 12 week CFR course
> did not cover
> > much of the material covered in my 2 day WFA course. When I assist
> > people on the trail, most of the skills I use are the ones
> I learned
> > in Wilderness First Aid, not from my CFR.
> >
> > Happy safe Hiking,
> > Tom
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: owner-philmont@troop47.com
> [mailto:owner-philmont@troop47.com]
> >> On Behalf Of Henry Buruel
> >> Sent: Friday, December 02, 2005 12:29 AM
> >> To: Multiple recipients of list philmont
> >> Subject: Re: [Philmont]: Peanuts, EpiPens, and Anaphylaxis
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -------------------------------------------------------
> > Scouting E-mail Discussion Lists @ usscouts.org
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe
> > at http://usscouts.org/lists/ Listserv Commands at
> > http://usscouts.org/lists/lc.asp
> > -------------------------------------------------------
> > Send listserv commands to: listserv@troop47.com
> > Send postings to: philmont@troop47.com
> > List FAQ found at: http://usscouts.org/lists/faq.asp
> > List Administrator: philmont_owner@troop47.com
> > -------------------------------------------------------
> > As you gather around this virtual campfire with fellow
> > Scouts and Scouters, do your best to be trustworthy,
> > loyal, helpful, friendly, courteous, kind, obedient, cheerful,
> > thrifty, brave, clean and reverent.
> > -------------------------------------------------------
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> -------------------------------------------------------
> Scouting E-mail Discussion Lists @ usscouts.org
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe at http://usscouts.org/lists/ Listserv
> Commands at http://usscouts.org/lists/lc.asp
> -------------------------------------------------------
> Send listserv commands to: listserv@troop47.com
> Send postings to: philmont@troop47.com
> List FAQ found at: http://usscouts.org/lists/faq.asp
> List Administrator: philmont_owner@troop47.com
> -------------------------------------------------------
> As you gather around this virtual campfire with fellow
> Scouts and Scouters, do your best to be trustworthy,
> loyal, helpful, friendly, courteous, kind, obedient,
> cheerful, thrifty, brave, clean and reverent.
> -------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

-------------------------------------------------------
Scouting E-mail Discussion Lists @ usscouts.org
Subscribe/Unsubscribe at http://usscouts.org/lists/
Listserv Commands at http://usscouts.org/lists/lc.asp
-------------------------------------------------------
Send listserv commands to: listserv@troop47.com
Send postings to: philmont@troop47.com
List FAQ found at: http://usscouts.org/lists/faq.asp
List Administrator: philmont_owner@troop47.com
-------------------------------------------------------
As you gather around this virtual campfire with fellow
Scouts and Scouters, do your best to be trustworthy,
loyal, helpful, friendly, courteous, kind, obedient,
cheerful, thrifty, brave, clean and reverent.
-------------------------------------------------------

 
Received on Sun Dec 4 08:25:44 2005