Re: [Philmont]: Another Good Adventure

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Waypoint banks.

I admire those who share waypoints with others such as the recently posted Troop445 lists. However!.............

 My only comment and I know nothing of the accuracy of their waypoints, is that many sharred waypoints in the past have been erronious. I have come to depend on collecting them from Topozone.com if I need a waypoint before a trip.

Another problem with shared waypoints is what does "Apachie Springs Camp" mean?. Is it the cabin you report to upon arrival? That troops campsite? The shower?

Then what is "Apache Springs Camp (2)" If you don't collect the waypoint, then you don't know. How about "Base Camp"? That's a pretty big place. How much value is an unknown waypoint? Is the proximity a mile or a few feet?

This is not condemation, just food for thought and an attempt to stimulate thinking on your part.
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The above is not taken as critisism. In fact, I appreciate the questions brought up here. Let me say that I believe the GPSr should not ever take the place of the map & compass, and is really not needed with the excellent trail system at Philmont. It can, however, be a useful tool in navigation when properly used. My GPSr loaded with topo maps and waypoints, along with the known elevation provided by the GPSR, can serve as an aid in trying to locate our position on the Philmont topo. The reason I'm a fan of using it at Philmont is because using it in the "controlled" space there will teach the Scouts to use it in "uncontrolled" areas with sparse/no trail systems.

As for the accuracy of the waypoints listed... the waypoints that are listed from RogerKnapp.com match almost exactly with a list of waypoints found at http://www.bsacac.org/philmont/trek_info/global_positioning_systems.htm. This site says the waypoints were provided by logistics at Philmont. After this link was e-mailed to me, I called Philmont to see if I could get a list of waypoints directly from them. The gentleman in charge of their computers is the guy I need to talk to, and was out at the time. I will be trying again. I have been told that Philmont has collected waypoints for every campsite fire ring on the ranch. If that is true, the list will be long if I can ever get my hands on it.

The list of waypoints on our site also has a column for "EXACT LOCATION." Since the only waypoints on the list with exact locations know are the waypoints we (Troop 445) took in 2002 (and a few with specific landmarks), those are the only ones with exact locations. I would assume the other points will get you in the vicinity of a staff cabin or the center of a trail camp (assume....). As others take waypoints and submit them, we will include the exact location if submitted.

The waypoints listed as "... (2)" are listed as such because more than one waypoint has been given for that camp/landmark. Again, the site states that the user can either upload both waypoints to the GPS, average them, or pick one.

Personally, I will be taking the GPSr to Philmont for my own enjoyment. I have taught my daughters and my Scouts how to use it, but they will only know it is with me if a situation REALLY calls for it. Some enjoy the harmonica on the trail, I enjoy the GPSr.

BTW, hope the surgery goes well and you have a full recovery! I'll be in and out for the next month as well. My mother is fighting a loosing battle with leukemia, so most of my time will be spent on the road between Oklahoma and Texas

Happy trails...
Shane Hoffman
ASM Troop 445
www.troop445.org
waypoints at http://home.comcast.net/~445philmont/philmontwaypoints.htm
SHoffman@troop445.org

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Received on Fri Jan 9 14:14:32 2004