All:
we just finished trek 9. Mike is right on the money on Greenwood Canyon. We took the next to last campsite there so that our hike to Copper parks would be shorter the next day. we got to Copper park the next day and took nice afternoon naps.
When we assualted Baldy we took the steep Northern Face and made 2,400 feet in 2 hours with a snowball fight included. This was the shortest yet most physically demanding climb. Our sister crew took the route Mike recommended and never made it to French Henry! Then we ate lunch in an alpine meadow, visited Baldytown to shower and pick up 60-70 lbs of food. Then the scouts elected to go to French Henry for program. When we hiked back up to Copper Park for dinner we dragged our legs in around 7:30 for a late dinner. an exhausting day but well worth it!
Sam Taylor ASM T89 Austin, Texas.
701-H1 trek #9
>>> On 16-Jul-07 at 9:29 AM, in message <MDAEMON-F200707160930.AA3011771pd50003769188@troop47.com>, <Michael_J_Conkey@nbc.gov> wrote:
We just returned from Trek 28 last Friday. A couple of additional comments
for those of you with this itinerary:
On our first day on the trail, we tried for an early bus and got 1 PM. We
hiked through Ponil and grabbed a root beer, then up to our campsite at
Dean Cutoff. We quickly did our ranger training and then added program at
Pueblano. If you can get a 9 AM bus, grab it. That would allow for more
time at Ponil and possibly even making it to Pueblano earlier than we did.
After dinner at Dean Cutoff, we hiked up the road (much, much shorter than
the trail) to Pueblano with our daypacks and made it in time for Advisor's
Coffee at 7 PM, Logger Ball at 7:15 and then campfire. We also signed up
for Spar Pole climbing the next day at 10 AM. We hiked back to Dean Cutoff
in the dark, but it was on a road so no big deal. It added about 7 miles,
round-trip, but our youth loved Logger Ball and felt the campfire was one
of the best. The next day, we hiked back to Pueblano for spar pole
climbing, had lunch, and then went over the Mesa to Rich Cabins. The
"trail" from Pueblano to Rich Cabins is mainly a logging road through the
wildlife area and really stunk. In fact, most of the "trails" we hiked in
the north were mining, logging or fire roads. Much of it was in the Valle,
so can't blame Philmont for those <g>!
Also, a bit funny, we started on the trail from Dean Cutoff to Pueblano and
then bailed onto the road Flume Canyon trail camp halfway there. What was
2 miles on the road was almost 5 miles on the trail....
I echo the comment that it is best to NOT camp at the first campsite in
Greenwood (like we did) just past the elk carcass (even though it is
beautiful) because it makes the next day to Copper Park about 12 miles. If
we had it to do over again, we'd hike another hour on the Rich Cabins to
Greenwood day and use a campsite further up the canyon (since this is a
short day anyway). Even with our long hike, we still got into Copper in
time to quickly setup camp and hike down to French Henry for program (with
daypacks). We were the only crew there at that time of day (4:00 PM) and
we got through all the program fairly expeditiously. By doing French Henry
on the first day, that allowed us to have a shorter day on the day we
summited Baldy. On the Baldy summit, use the new trail back up towards
Greenwood, then take the ridge trail to the summit. That was MUCH better
that the other trail routes. The trail down the other side to Baldy Town
needs some help. I'm glad we were going down it, not coming up it. I felt
bad telling climbing crews what was ahead of them.....
Also, our neighbors were stalked by a mountain lion in Greenwood and there
was tons of cat scat on that trail.
We contemplated adding Miranda on the day to Upper Dean Cow, but the youth
eventually decided they didn't want to climb the ridge again. We made a
wrong turn heading back to Baldy Town and ended up on the French
Henry/Aztec Mine road. This mistake was a blessing in disguise because we
ran into a big ol' bear photo op. We enjoyed the program at Head of Dean
and the advisors hiked back to Head of Dean from Upper Dean Cow for
advisor's coffee that evening.
The conservation project for us was a trail to the shotgun range at Harlan,
but that will be done very soon. We asked where the next project will be
and the staff didn't know, but felt it would be in the Harlan area
somewhere, possibly re-building some existing trail.
The advisors hiked into Cito for advisor's coffee from Ute Springs (30
minutes each way). The youth contemplated going for some volleyball and
climbing wall, but decided to stay in Ute Springs for some necessary time
resolving some crew issues (sans advisors). When you commissary at Ute
Gulch, be sure to say Hi to Clifford. He is a great guy.
The next day, we hiked Hidden Valley to Window Rock, and then down to
Hunting Lodge (a beautiful hike). The tour guide at Hunting Lodge had a
lot to be desired. He was very soft spoken and unenthusiastic. We had a
similar-style tour guide at the Villa Philmonte. I would think they would
need to be more passionate about their job, both seemed to be bored with
the whole thing. We provided feedback on the ability of our tour guides in
general. They knew their stuff, but the presentation was fairly dry....
We also got an early start from Clarks and got back to base camp about 2:30
PM after summiting the TOT. We did pizza and ice cream.
Some general comments. The biting flies were horrible at a couple of camps
(Baldy Town and Clarks Fork). The kids started calling Baldy Town "Fly
Town" after going to the Red Roof and looking down to see a seething mass
of flies underneath. There were flies at MOST camps, although the
mosquitoes weren't too bad (we only saw a few). The campfire at Clarks
needed some help, but we really liked the ones at Pueblano and Rich Cabins.
This was my first trip to the North since I was a youth and I can honestly
say that the "trails" need some work. Most are logging/mining/fire roads,
not up to Philmont's grade standards and tough on the feet. We were
thinking back to the nice trails in the South country and getting kind of
jealous. The weather was perfect, just what we wanted. We only got our
rain gear out twice and both times it was barely enough to make it
worthwhile. It did rain on us a couple of times in our tents. The ranch
is drying up, so can't imagine how long the Shaeffer's spring will still be
running. Monsoon season appeared to be starting when we left, the last day
was cloudy all day. All the backcountry trading posts were short on
change, so I would recommend bringing your "trail money" in small
denominations and include some quarters.
Showers were great at Baldy Town, Harlan and Clarks Fork. We could have
done showers at Cito as well, but Clarks Fork was the next day so we didn't
worry about it. Meals were great. Lunches were still cracker-mania, but
some changes in the dinners. There are now six kinds of gorp - Richmoor
regular, Richmoor tropical, reeses pieces, santa fe, commercial regular and
commercial fruit. We loved the burrito dinner and vegetarian chili (with
chicken soup, so not really vegetarian). You get a couple of hot
breakfasts, so plan these for your short days. If you eat everything they
give you, you certainly won't lose weight. Some of those "bars" are 250
calories, with 100 calories from fat. Still plenty of heavy drink mixes
(Gatorade mainly, plus some breakfast drinks), so if you aren't a Gatorade
person, open your meals at commissary and remove the weight.
We added program and route changes to get us up over 100 miles (base trek
mileage is 78 miles). We used a GPS, so are comfortable with the 106 miles
we came off the trail with. The advisors probably had another 6-8 miles
for the couple of advisor coffee's to which we hiked. I'm guessing that
even if we stuck with the base route, adding no program, you would still be
around 10 miles above the base trek mileage when you add in all the
switchbacks, etc. Not sure how Philmont comes up with their mileage???
If you have more detailed questions, just drop me a line? I can see what
this is the most popular itinerary on the ranch. It has lots of program
features, and includes Baldy and TOT. YIS. Mike Conkey ('76, '02, '04 and
'07).
|---------+---------------------------->
| | "Fred Rothwell" |
| | <rothwell@kansas.|
| | net> |
| | Sent by: |
| | Philmont@troop47.|
| | com |
| | |
| | |
| | 07/12/2007 04:12 |
| | PM |
| | Please respond to|
| | philmont |
| | |
|---------+---------------------------->
>------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------|
| |
| To: "Philmont List Member" <Philmont@troop47.com> |
| cc: (bcc: Michael J Conkey/NBC/OS/DOI) |
| Subject: [Philmont] Treks 28 or 31 results/info |
>------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------|
----- Original Message -----
From: Fred Rothwell
To: Alan D. Miller
Sent: Friday, July 06, 2007 4:29 PM
Subject: Re: [Philmont] Treks 28 or 31 results/info
----- Original Message -----
From: Fred Rothwell
To: Alan D. Miller
Sent: Tuesday, July 03, 2007 5:01 PM
Subject: Re: [Philmont] Treks 28 or 31 results/info
Alan, The trek is everything they say it is. Out of my 8 treks this has to
be the second strenuous one. Lots of elevation gain and give everyday
starting with the run up to Greenwood Canyon. But it was fun especially if
you get an early start each day. Water was not a problem on most of the
trek. It seemed that Philmont had a wet winter and spring and we had more
water crossings than in the past.
The water at Rich Cabins is not purified according to the staff so you
have to get water from the stream that runs thru camp.
Water is available all the way to the mouth of Greenwood Canyon and is
usually easily accessible as you hike into the canyon. Get an early start
and hike as high into the Canyon as you can, so that you don't have as far
to go the next day into Copper Park. Camp sites are available on your left
as you go up. They start to get scarce about half way up, so I would start
to think of grabbing one by half way. Load up on water before you leave
the next a.m. as it is scarce and hard to get to the higher you go. You
should make the top @ noon or before depending on how early you stare and
how strong your crew is at hiking. The switchbacks are a great improvement
from thru slide down two years ago. The trail starts at the top to your
left as you look down on Copper Park and is marked by two flags on the
trees. We got caught in a rain/hail storm as we were going down and the
temp. dropped and got real cold for the rest of the night. In fact the
temp. at night was much colder than in the past until we got to Dean Cow.
You will be starting much later so it might be warmer then but, be
prepared.
Water is available at Copper Park from the spring and they have a spigot
near the lower bear cable. It needs to be treated. We started our climb up
Baldy @ 7 a.m. and were up by @ 9 a.m. We took the traditional route but
one crew was going to take the switchback trail back to the top of
Greenwood Canyon and then hike the ridge over to Baldy and then up to the
top the last few hundred feet to the top. Don't know how it turned out for
them but it sure looked better and you did not have to fight those rocks!
We went down the front to Baldy town for a food pickup and then to French
Henry for program and then up the wall back to Copper Park. It was a long
day.
The next day we hiked down thru Ewells Park to the Baldy skyline trail to
Head of Dean for program. We had a hard time picking up the trail Just
before the junction of the Pueblano, Baldy Skyline and The trail that
leads down to Miranda/Maxwell because of the fire line they cut. You will
find the trail to your left as you come up on the fire line or you hike
the fire line and you will come to the trail crossing but you are in the
open and it is hot. We found the trail, Much preferred way to hike than
out in the open.
We had a stand off with a bear as we were going thru Ewells Park for 10 to
15 minuets at about 15 to 20 feet on the trail. It seemed to want to go
and follow us on the trail and we could not shake it. Everytime we would
move it would move in the same direction or follow us. We finally stood
firm for @ 5 to 10 minunets at 15 feet and it decided to find another
route to the campsite it wanted to check out. They are really near sighted
and we all grouped together to make a big mass and made a lot of noise. It
was not a real big bear. The staff camp at Head of Dean did not seem
interested at all and no one had us fill out any reports and I am not sure
base camp was ever informed.
We did Program at Head of Dean. Try to get in there early as lots of crews
pass thru and afternoon storms have a way of backing things up. Staff was
excellent working with the boys. Fill up with water before leaving for
Upper Dean Cow as the water is purerified at Head of Dean.
Dean Cow program was excellent and the crew liked the staff. Water was
from a stream. Start out as early as you can the next morning, quite a
climb up and you have to go thru Turkey Creek Canyon and under the highway
and back up the other side to Harlan. You want to get there as early as
possible as the heat on the road and switchbacks make for a long day. Fill
up with water before leaving Dean Cow as water is scarce and filling up st
the Cimarron River can be done but only if you really need to.
The crew has a blast at Harlan with shotguns and Burro racing. Staff o.k.
Water puerified. The Cons is about a 1.5 to 2 hr. hike fron Harlan with
full packs the next morning following the cons crew. It consist of
reopening a 3-4 year old trail that has not been used. Duaty and hot and
the cons crew kept us the whole 3 hours. You can hike on down the trail to
the road for a hot and long hike to Ute Springs. No water available until
you get to camp (stream). We had to hike it after lunch. Wt camped in
campsite 10. water near by. Food pickup at Ute Gulch.
The next day we hiked to Clarks Fork by way of Hidden Valley and
Cimarroncito, nice hike and ate breakfast at Cito. Visited the Hunting
lodge and was in Clarks by 10:30 a.m.
The staff at Clarks seemed lazy and stuck us in a campsite in the lower
part of camp. Terrible site, no place tp put up tents (I think it was site
18) except within 5 feet from sump or out in a meadow that collected all
of the rain water when it rained. So we moved in with our sister crew and
camped with them. We had two small crews 8 in one and 7 in another. It
rained a lot that night so was glad we did not camp in the meadow and
since they had a bear problem glad we were not on top of the sump.
We got up at 4 a.m. and left Clarks at 5:40 a.m. full of water. On
Sgeaffers pass in 1.5 hr. Spring running great so we did not have to pack
extra water up. Just filled up there and ate breakfast. We missed the
start of the switchback trail up to the peak so we went straight up until
we crossed the trail. The hike accross tooth ridge rocky and slow and
takes a couple of hours to reach the tooth. Keep together. Our crew went
up and down the tooth in about 30 min. Make sure you manage your water as
the hike from the tooth to base camp is long and hot. We came into base
camp at 2:45 p.m.
trek 28 is a great trek with a lot of things to do and a lot oif miles to
cover. The key is to start early and try to do your hiking in the early
part of the day. -Water is abundent except in some places and logisticts
should inform you of areas to be concerned or just ask the staff at the
camps you pass thru. The flies and horse flies were amuch more of a
problem than I can ever remember and they do bite. Mosquetos did not seem
to know what to do other than buzz you. We never used bug spray. The food
was good and plenty of it. Spice wheel sure came in handy. We made all one
pot meals, sometimes using the turkey bag method and other times using the
pot depending on if the cook wanted to wash it or not. What ever the crew
decided to do we did.
Rain was not muck of a problem for us as the afternoon thunder storms all
seemed to miss us except for Copper Park byt, you never know at Philmont
so be prepaired.
I hope this helps and you have as good and successful trek as we did. If
you have any other questions please let me know and I will try to answer
as quickly as I can.
----- Original Message -----
From: Alan D. Miller
To: rothwell@kansas.net
Sent: Tuesday, July 03, 2007 12:40 PM
Subject: Re: [Philmont] Treks 28 or 31 results/info
We'd be most interested in water availability and trail conditions I
suppose. Also, bear sightings or anything else we need to be mindful of.
How are the programs? Anything you can share will be helpful.
Thanks in advance.
Alan Miller
-------------- Original message --------------
From: "Fred Rothwell" <rothwell@kansas.net>
Alan, Just came off trek 28 on July 1st. Will try to get something up in
the next few days. Do you have any specific questions that I can answer
as well?
----- Original Message -----
From: Alan Miller
To: Philmont List Member
Sent: Friday, June 29, 2007 6:25 AM
Subject: [Philmont] Treks 28 or 31 results/info
Looking for trail info and tips from crews coming off Treks 28 or 31....
Alan Miller, Advisor
Crew 709-N1 (#31) and 709-N2 (#28)
Troop 125, Rochester, MI
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Received on Mon Jul 16 10:03:51 2007
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