RE: [Philmont]: Help

Is there a WAIT list???? If there is, you might say that the scout will be
cut from the crew and someone from the Wait list will be added if this scout
is unwilling to get the appropriate GEAR for the training treks and
Philmont.

I agree that the equipment needed doesn't have to be expensive. AND the
fact that you have offered to Lend the scout equipment, there is no excuse.
Obviously the parents and scout do not understand, and unwilling to listen
to the reason behind the gear list.

I would worry about the safety and mental attitude of this scout and how his
problems on the trail would quickly become the problems of everyone in the
crew.

Kim Pigorsch
Membership Chairmun (sic)

www.troop681.org

San Diego, CA

>From: "Larry Daniell" <daniellhome@comcast.net>
>Reply-To: philmont@troop47.com
>To: Multiple recipients of list philmont <philmont@troop47.com>
>Subject: RE: [Philmont]: Help
>Date: Sat, 4 Jun 2005 13:47:06 -0500
>
>Ditto.
>I am all for trying to help folks.......but......
>This is going to sound bad, but, after trying the best you can to get them
>where they need to be in a positive way in the best traditions of Scouting,
>if it's not working.....the best thing to do is to make a clean break.
>Doing it for a weekend trip is one thing...Philmont is quite another! As a
>leader on the trip, if you have someone that is severely ill-prepared...an
>unwilling or unable to get prepared, it's going to start bad and be a
>really
>ugly situation after the third day. IMHO, the real, true, lasting value of
>a trip like Philmont is the lessons learned in proper preparation. The
>outing itself is the icing/motivation/payoff.
>
>I wish to be clear here and make sure you understand that I am not talking
>about a kid who is willing and is just slower than the others.....that is
>part of the trip and something to work on in a positive way during
>proportion and I would NOT advocate cutting such a kid off. I talking of
>someone who, after careful clear communication and positive encouragement,
>doesn't get it and does not do what is necessary to get ready. This is why
>I have set the bar high when leading a high adventure trip to communicate
>what is expected VERY EARLY AND CLEARLY before anyone has sighed up.
>
>Larry Daniell
>Huntsville, AL
>ASM T361
>
> _____
>
>From: owner-philmont@troop47.com [mailto:owner-philmont@troop47.com] On
>Behalf Of Pete Swiggum
>Sent: Saturday, June 04, 2005 12:49 PM
>To: Multiple recipients of list philmont
>Subject: Re: [Philmont]: Help
>
>
>My thoughts exactly. Any Scout who is that ill-prepared and has parents
>who
>aren't interested in preparing him properly, should be staying home.
>
>I agree with the person who said that Scouting is all about learning and
>the
>boy should be allowed to go with the gear he has as along as it's not a
>safety issue. However, if this situation is as it sounds, the boy and the
>parents don't have a clue and aren't interested in getting one.
>
>After all attempts to get him "geared up" have failed, I'd cut him and
>invite him to go next time - after he understands the importance of being
>properly equipped.
>
>Pete Swiggum
>Troop 1173
>Green Bay, WI
>Peter.Swiggum@sbcglobal.net
>2005 Philmont 724-M2
>
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: Joe <mailto:j.tavares@comcast.net> Tavares
>To: Multiple recipients of list philmont <mailto:philmont@troop47.com>
>Sent: Saturday, June 04, 2005 12:36 PM
>Subject: RE: [Philmont]: help
>
>I assume you are the lead advisor. You need to explain to the *scout* that
>if he is not adequately prepared, based on the list of equipment that you
>have provided (you did provide the list?), then he can't go and his fees
>will not be refunded.
>
> _____
>
>From: owner-philmont@troop47.com [mailto:owner-philmont@troop47.com] On
>Behalf Of Magnevolt@aol.com
>Sent: Saturday, June 04, 2005 6:27 AM
>To: Multiple recipients of list philmont
>Subject: Re: [Philmont]: help
>
>
>We are going to Philmont in July.
>I have a parent who is driving me to drink.
>First she wanted to let her son hike in tennis shoes.
>I explained why that was not a good idea.
>We have had a pack inspection before each of the last two hikes.
>On the last two practice hikes her son brought Deodorant, Hair gel, and
>shampoo even though there was no place to take a shower, and we had told
>them not to bring things like this on the trail.
>He brought flip flops on the last hike. His rain gear consisted of a thin
>poncho that had holes in it. Some of the holes were patched with duct tape.
>Others were left not patched. He did not bring a cold weather layer.
>I have explained the reasons (in a nice way) for having the items in the
>guidebook on the trail to him and the parent. I have tried to explain that
>the parent does not have to go out and buy the most expensive, lightest
>weight, newest item just get some equipment to protect her son on the
>trail.
>I have also explained that if money is an issue please let me know and I
>would lend the scout some equipment. They have the Guidebook, and I have
>Emailed a personal list of equipment just like the guidebook to all the
>crew.
>The parent is now calling the Contingent leader and complaining to him that
>I am being a stickler about the equipment. She is also calling other
>parents
>and complaining about me and the equipment needs. This is having a negative
>affect on crew harmony.
>I consider this a straight safety issue. I have been to Philmont, HH and
>know what can happen if you do not have rain gear, cold weather clothes
>layer, boots, etc.,etc.
>
>Back ground info: The crew is made up of 7 scouts and two adults from this
>parents troop. Two scouts and myself are making up the balance of the crew.
>We are from a different troop. This parents troop has had very little
>backpacking experience (three of them have been on one hike, ever, That is
>their backpacking experience.).
>
>Have any of you have a similar problem. I have not.
>
>Thanks for your help.
>Name withheld because I do not need any more trouble
>
>
>
>
>
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>

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Received on Sat Jun 4 17:11:08 2005