Starting to be sorry I started this thread.
I've been doing a lot of legal research on wilderness first aid. My research
was first started by the Wilderness Medical Society. (http://www.wms.org/).
One of the things I found that I still don't have a handle on is the Good
Samaritan law and no one else does either. I should have been clear I'm not
worried about NM. I am worried about taking a class and then using the
skills where you might be protected. At the same time Good Sam lawsuits are
very rare. There are even issues popping up that Good Sam covers first aid
but not rescue. (CA for one.)
If you want to learn the most about Wilderness First aid the book to start
with is the WMS Practice Guidelines (http://www.wms.org/pubs/practice.html).
It starts by defining wilderness first aid. The editor is William Forgey
who serves on the BSA health and safety committee. Bill (Forgey) has written
some very good books on the subject aimed at the BSA program.
Take any class that qualifies and go to Philmont. Have a good time, don't
get hurt.
Jim
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James H. Moss, Attorney specializing in Recreation Law
Recreation Law Blog: <http://rec-law.blogspot.com/>
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Instructor: Ski Area Operations, Risk Management Course Colorado Mountain
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P Please consider the environment before printing this email
From: philmont@troop47.com [mailto:philmont@troop47.com] On Behalf Of Larry
Taylor
Sent: Friday, March 07, 2008 10:40 AM
To: philmont List Member
Subject: [philmont] Wilderness First Aid
Doug,
I agree with you that stating a opinion ( a respectful and kind opinion) is
not against the
Scouting Spirit
But your comment "situations involving one
of the boys developing a pregnant rash excepted" seemed flip and
denigrating the wide variety of skills even one of our specialist doctors
carries in his /her hands and skull.
Most doctors of my I have meet would take a WFA class if they had time and
they do clear their schedule for class.
In fact, I know of a doctor in his late 50's and quite out of shape and who
will not backpack because he does not think that he is up to it -- who took
WFA class last October from our Council.
Doctors have not only a 4 year university degree, but also a 4 year medical
school degree and all doctors have the same basic education the first 3
years, then after the graduate they have to do a internship at teaching
hospital where they do rounds and work in the ER.
So some person who eventually becomes an OB/GYN or dermatologist may have
set bones, sutured open wounds, repair cut arteries, not only do CPR on a
real person but used a defibrillator and save
persons life, as well as diagnosed all sorts of weird problems that people
bring to emergency wards.
If the outback you have to stabilize a patient and move them IF possible,
certainly the Doctors are ALL qualified to stabilize the patient. stabilize
patients with the supplies on hands -- since doctors know what they need
faster than you and I might they might be able to improvise faster than you
or I and save the persons life. Perhaps they have never had to move a
patient from a mountaintop or a rushing riverbed and so sure they could use
some training.
Someplace like Philmont certainly does not require a crew to move a patient
since they have rangers who evac wounded and 4x4 vehicles are plenty. Crews
who go to Philmont are in for a treat to be sure but its a much more
protected trek than say a National Forest in Colorado.
Sorry that I jumped all over you! I suppose you were trying to inject some
humor.
BTW, girls are accepted to Philmont crews and If they are adoloescent then
we might need and OB/GYN/Dermatolgist ;)
YiS
Sam
Prudence, Justice, Fortitude, Temperance
>>> On 07-Mar-08 at 11:17 AM, in message
<MDAEMON-F200803071117.AA1723464pd50005561563@troop47.com>, Doug Kemp
<vetpharm@uga.edu> wrote:
Larry
I am sorry you took offense. I was not attacking physicians, but was
criticising a decision that provides an exemption for a very diverse group
of individuals based on having a degree rather than being qualified to
perform under outback conditions.
I do not believe that having and stating an opinion based upon observation
and experience is outside of the Scouting Spirit.
>>>a dermatologist, OB/GYN or thoracic surgeon all have the same basic
training + their specialized training. Also, they all have similiar intern
training experiences. They intern at teaching hospitals not in their
specialities.<<<
Actually, no. They started phasing out internships in the 1970s. I have
been associated with several teaching hospitals. Medical College of Georgia
(way back when), Grady Memorial, Crawford Long and Georgia Baptist on the
human side, all of which had residency programs (and internships way back
when). And for 25 years I was director of pharmacy at UGA Veterinary
Teaching Hospital where we had internships and residencies. Even within the
same school all interships were not created equal. And each person comes in
with their own unique characteristics.
>>>All have the training need to suture a deep wound, take care of simple or
compound fractures or
pronouncing a fat, overweight, out of shape advisor dead on the spot of his
heart attack. <<<
I have to disagree based upon my health care experiences.
<>>>>I think that you will find that not many MDs or ODs
agree and they will probably get some first aid training.<<<
That is a point on which we agree.
>>.You tone when you said , "I doubt that practicing OB/GYN
or dermatology would do much to prepare an MD to make appropriate
treatment decisions in a back country setting - situations involving one
of the boys developing a pregnant rash excepted"<<<
You left of the smiley face. It was an attempt at humor. I am truly sorry
that it came across otherwise.
>>> An OB/GYN would suture me up better<<<
Not likely you'll need an episiotomy on trek, but maybe I'm missing
something..... :-)) <--- note - another smiley face. :-))
YiS
Doug
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Received on Fri Mar 7 12:03:36 2008
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