From: Gary Boyd (g.dboyd@verizon.net)
Date: Tue Oct 08 2002 - 08:59:22 CDT
Sorry to disagree, but the thought that one person doesn't see a
particular act as hazing is analogous to the boss (male or female)
saying that an act or phrase isn't harassment. If the act was unwanted,
meaning the scout or leader was expecting a real stamp or other visible
memento, and the staffer, burned a page, used a knife or axe or did
something different and unwanted, that is an act of hazing.
A staff member who has an unusual "marking" method, should at least have
the courtesy to say "I like to mark in this way, is that alright?"
Otherwise, it is no different than a boss patting an employee co-worker
on the bottom and saying "good job" and never asking himself/herself
whether that action is appropriate or considerate.
What ever happed to Law #5?
Gary Boyd
Troop 151 CC
Crew 151 CC
Georgetown, Texas
www.troop151.org
S & S Parsons wrote:
>I agree with Rob 110%!
>
>Scott Parsons
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Robert Haig" <rhaig@hackboy.com>
>To: "Multiple recipients of list philmont" <philmont@troop47.com>
>Sent: Monday, October 07, 2002 5:36 PM
>Subject: Re: [Philmont]: Crew Leader "Stamps"
>
>
>
>
>>On Mon, Oct 07, 2002 at 08:13:19PM -0400, MWDillon@aol.com wrote:
>>
>>
>>>I heard this was happening early in the summer, but we didn't have any
>>>trouble when we went in August. I have an acquaintance who is a back
>>>
>>>
>country
>
>
>>>manager and said when they heard of this practice they put a stop to it.
>>>There is no hazing in Scouts.
>>>
>>>
>>True, nor should there be. But, while carving the staffed camp "stamp"
>>in the book may not be what the crew leader was expecting, I don't see it
>>as hazing.
>>
>>Nor do I see asking a scout to sing for a lost item (handbook, pocket
>>
>>
>knife,
>
>
>>whatever..) as hazing. Though not returning the item if the scout refuses
>>
>>
>to
>
>
>>sing is wrong. Whenever I was asked to sing, or saw anyone asked to sing
>>during my time as a scout (years ago) it was always phrased as "Someone
>>
>>
>was
>
>
>>kind enough to turn in your item to us, will you be kind enough to sing us
>>a verse?" If the scout refused, the item was returned on the spot. And
>>
>>
>yes,
>
>
>>some did refuse, usually with a polite "no thank you" or "I'd rather not".
>>
>>Nor do I see asking a scout to "sing for seconds" as hazing, though that
>>discussion has been beaten to death on a different philmont list.
>>
>>For those who say singing for a lost item is hazing through embarassment,
>>then isn't it embarassing to have your handbook returned to you at dinner?
>>What, we should return it through the scoutmasters so the boy is spared
>>
>>
>any
>
>
>>repercussions of his actions? (oops, I'll stop now before I really get
>>
>>
>started)
>
>
>>I know hazing, I've seen it, and dealt with it (not in scouts though).
>>This isn't it.
>>
>>--
>>Rob
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
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>>
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>>
>>
>
>
>
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>As you gather around this virtual campfire with fellow
>Scouts and Scouters, do your best to be trustworthy,
>loyal, helpful, friendly, courteous, kind, obedient,
>cheerful, thrifty, brave, clean and reverent.
>-------------------------------------------------------
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Scouting E-mail Discussion Lists @ usscouts.org
Subscribe/Unsubscribe at http://usscouts.org/lists/
Listserv Commands at http://usscouts.org/lists/lc.asp
-------------------------------------------------------
Send listserv commands to: listserv@troop47.com
Send postings to: philmont@troop47.com
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-------------------------------------------------------
As you gather around this virtual campfire with fellow
Scouts and Scouters, do your best to be trustworthy,
loyal, helpful, friendly, courteous, kind, obedient,
cheerful, thrifty, brave, clean and reverent.
-------------------------------------------------------
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